Sunday, September 30, 2007

Clubbells, kettlebells, swing, acceleration and torque.


While purusing Scott Sonnons RMax site for info about my soon to be delivered clubbells I found this very interesting article on
the physics of circular or pendulum swings and how increasing the speed of a circular motion dramatically increases the torque,force AND the work involved.
If one substitutes 'kettlebell' for 'clubbell' in the article you end up with the same thing I have been saying for a long time: increasing the speed of the swing or snatch via compensatory acceleration dramatically( exponentially)increases the forces involved in the movement.This is the essence of the RKC Hardstyle methods.
Now the clubbell is much longer than the kb but the same physics should apply.
Those who scoffed at Kenneth Jays force plate data need to read this carefully.
Can't wait for the clubbells to come, they should be very fun.

12 comments:

Pete said...

Rif,

You will have fun with them! I made a homemade pair (7 lbs each) a couple of years ago as an experiment. Felt really good opening up the shoulders. Ken had a few real clubbells, so I got to try the real thing. It will make a good complement to your training.

leslie said...

Can't wait to see how you'll add them into your workouts. They really do look like fun!

BJ Bliffert said...

You'll like the clubs, Rif. They are an interesting animal.

Did you get the DVD too?

BJ

Franz Snideman said...

Rif,

I agree with you on speeding up the movement to produce greater force output. Frankly, I cannot understand why anyone would disagree with that.

On a different note, you might find this Q and A with Joe Defranco interesting. What he learned from Louie Simmons on the importance on quality reps (that produce lots of power)


Q: Joe D - Why do you only perform 1-3 rep sets on dynamic day?? I noticed in past responses you list dynamic box squats for multiple sets of 2 reps. Now you seem to prefer 1-3 jumps per set on dynamic day. Can’t you perform 5-6 reps explosively on dynamic day? Lets say 5 sets of 6 reps instead of 8 sets of 3 reps? Does it really matter?
Phil

A: Phil,
Strength training can be accomplished in three ways:

#1 - Lifting a maximal load, a.k.a, the maximal-effort method

#2 - Lifting a sub-maximal load to failure or near failure, a.k.a, the repeated-effort method

#3 – Lifting, throwing or jumping with a sub-maximal load with the highest possible speed, a.k.a, the dynamic-effort method

1-3 rep sets are superior to 6-rep sets on dynamic-effort day because this enables you to apply the adequate amount of velocity and force to the bar (assuming you’re training with the proper percentages) with every repetition. Simply put, all reps of your workout will be quality, explosive reps.

I learned a simple explanation of this from Louie Simmons. He used the example of throwing a basketball up in the air -- When the ball first hits the ground, it bounces the highest. Then, with each subsequent bounce, the ball loses energy and it bounces lower and lower. The same “loss of energy” happens with each repetition of a weightlifting set. Basically, we want our reps on dynamic-effort lower body day to be like the first couple bounces of the basketball. That is, we want the reps to be powerful and we want to execute each rep with perfect form! If we performed 5 or 6-rep sets with our dynamic lift, velocity slows down as our form breaks down. This isn’t as effective when you’re trying to develop speed-strength. This is why I prefer 1-3 reps for your dynamic exercises --- every rep will be like the first few “bounces of the basketball”.

Mark Reifkind said...

bj,
i didnt get the dvd, the only one I saw was $149 and that was too much. we'll see.

Mark Reifkind said...

franz,

exactly. being a sprinter you know this intuitively. As far as the Louie info, I have been into that stuff since 1993, doing sets of 2 with weights we could have done 6 with but with as much accelerative force as possible.
The goal was never to have the reps within the entirety of the whole workout ( 12 sets of 2) never slow down. SO 24 reps with 100$ max effort force.The synergy of that kind of work has to be felt to be understood.Unless you can do math,lol.

Aaron Friday said...

When you're not using them for fitness, you can use them for bashing the brains out of home invaders, so it's win-win. Excellent choice.

Anonymous said...

Hey Rif, yeah good article.. Same thing with kbs... Amazing how some people discards laws of physics because they don't "agree" and it doesn't fit with their picture. If one's got a problem with F = m x a then take it up with Sir Issac Newton. :-)

Mark Reifkind said...

yeah, physics, it's not just for school anymore. I'm just glad it came from one of their own. have heard almost nothing about it since I posted it,lol.

Mark Reifkind said...

aaron,
exactly. it'll have to do till I get the mossberg.

Rob O'Brien said...

Just ordered one for myself. Do you like it? I am looking forward to working it into my training!

albina N muro said...

the physics of circular or pendulum swings and how increasing the speed of a circular motion dramatically increases the torque,force AND the work involved. kettlebell workshop

195 x 1 x 9 205 x 1 225 x CLOSE! 205 x 1 20kg swings 5 x 8/8, floor pushups 40, 30

 What a great day! Moved my grip and my stance back in. Concentrated on pushing UP on the bar un takeoff and then decided, during warmups, t...